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Old 04-23-2013, 10:58 AM   #1
Karmashock

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Default Just sort of an interesting observation about the bombing...

http://www.americanthinker.com/2013/...the_fraud.html


Here it is pointed out that the bomber became a US citizen WHILE being pretty virulently anti american. When you become a naturalized citizen you take an oath as part of it. The oath effectively boils down to whether or not you're willing to hold the US as your home and its people as YOUR people.

He clearly wasn't willing to accept either of those conditions and yet swore otherwise. That is actually fraud.

And given that his oath was a fraud, his citizenship is legally suspect if not outright invalid.


Which means... technically... we might be able to treat this little anal wart as an enemy combatant.


I do not think we should. But I do think we should revoke his citizenship prior to interrogating him (within conventional legal limits permitted convicted felons) and then finally after due process is served the inevitable execution (He's guilty and the offense is a capital one. Beyond that, he's the sort of fellow Americans generally don't mind sending to the block.).

In any case, I thought thought it was an interesting observation that this guy technically probably isn't even a US citizen as a result of his obvious fraud. Someone simply born into citizenship wouldn't have to hold the same standard. But naturalized citizens give an oath... and it is legally binding.
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Old 04-23-2013, 02:31 PM   #2
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So technically you could take away the citizenship of any naturalized citizen if he/she commits a crime?
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Old 04-23-2013, 02:50 PM   #3
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So technically you could take away the citizenship of any naturalized citizen if he/she commits a crime?
No... if they commit specific types of crime.


For example, during WW2 some germans were granted US citizenship. Those same germans were actually spies and only acquired the citizenship as a means to gain information, attempt to assassinate various American officials, and/or plant bombs in industrial hubs.

In those cases, their citizenship was removed on the grounds that they lied when the citizenship was granted. They were typically interrogated, there was a trial, and an execution. Enemy agents are killed in time of war. Are we not playing for blood?


If I make a deal with you. And you lie to me... am I bound to uphold my end of the deal even though you did not?


We're not talking about people that kill their wives or husbands for sleeping around.
We're not talking about selling meth on the corner.
We're not talking about drunk driving and killing a few kids because you're a selfish drunked ahole.


We're talking about methodically plotting the deaths of other "citizens" to serve the interests of a foreign/extra-national power.

That is just the sort of thing you promise you're not going to do when you are granted citizenship in the first place.


You do that and it means you betrayed your oath. And as such... why should I honor my end of the deal if you don't honor yours?



Again, not saying the guy should be shipped off to gitmo. He's useless in any case. The younger brother is just a stoner idiot that the elder brother brainwashed into the scheme. The man we wanted is sadly dead before he could be juiced like an orange. And regardless, extra-legal interrogations are not required outside of war zones. The political cost of such actions are more then enough to make them prohibitive.

No... by all means flush him through the court system like human shit.


I'd extend him all benefits of being a US citizen throughout. All save one. I would strip his citizenship from him and from his brother. I might deport his corpse.


Beyond that, he'd get every benefit of conventional legal due process. There is no reason not to grant that.

But he clearly lied when he was granted citizenship. And I approve of the precedent for stripping citizenship in cases where people commit acts of treason against the nation that welcomed them and gave them a chance.


Look at the lives these young men had. Was American society cruel to them? Did we not welcome them or give them opportunities?


If society is to blame for what these men did then it was not my society. We did nothing to justify this atrocity. Our only crime was having an open heart so these snakes could stab it.


We are proud of our openness. That will not change. But it doesn't mean we need to let specific individuals lie through the immigration process, kill our people, and then remain members of our society when they clearly were never members of our society.
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Old 04-23-2013, 04:13 PM   #4
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That's an interesting tidbit.
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Old 04-24-2013, 02:50 PM   #5
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This whole Boston bombing thing stinks of a government cover up. i have very heavy doubts that these 2 kids did it.


Plz do not throw away our justice system. he needs to be treated fairly and judged rightly, not as an "anal wart"
"innocent until proven guilty"

(insert Karmashock rage post)
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Old 04-24-2013, 03:03 PM   #6
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This whole Boston bombing thing stinks of a government cover up. i have very heavy doubts that these 2 kids did it.
Really? Government cover up?


So... Tell me what really happened?

Was it the aliens again? Which ones? The grays or the fuzzy green ones?


Quote:
Plz do not throw away our justice system. he needs to be treated fairly and judged rightly, not as an "anal wart"
"innocent until proven guilty"
Nowhere did I say it would or should be thrown out.

But a mass murdering piece of shit is still a mass murdering piece of shit. But by all means if you need a court trial to prove that fine.


Of course, that means you hold the opinion of a court above your own opinion... right?


Since you think this is a government cover up explain to me how you can accept the opinion of a court of law when you take every event as some sort of shadowy conspiracy?


If the government is so twisted that they'd kill people randomly in these incidents for some political gain then why couldn't they also rig court trials? Do you honestly think it would be harder to rig a court trial, bribe some judges, fake some evidence, then it would be to concoct some elaborate conspiracy involving multiple law enforcement agencies at a city, state, and federal level? Do you even begin to understand how idiotically unlikely a government conspiracy is in this case?


The problem here is that you're stupid. I wish you were just unwise but it's worse then that. The contradictions in your own logic are so obvious that you couldn't miss them unless you were mentally deficient. So you're clearly mentally deficient.


We can continue beyond this point if you want but I'm probably going to condescend to you... as you deserve.


And before you complain... you lost any chance of me being nicer to you then you deserve by posting snarky crap like this:

Quote:
(insert Karmashock rage post)
F' you.
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Old 04-24-2013, 03:11 PM   #7
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karmashock lol im not going to try to convince you all you do whenever i try to debate with you is attack me.

Point proved
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Old 04-24-2013, 06:50 PM   #8
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By whom I wonder.
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Old 04-24-2013, 07:13 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edman1939 View Post
karmashock lol im not going to try to convince you all you do whenever i try to debate with you is attack me.

Point proved
You said a terrorist bomb that killed lots of people in boston was a government conspiracy and then said that you'd only accept someone being guilty if they were proven guilty in a government court room.


You're dumb.


If the government was involved in the terrorist attack then they could corrupt the court case even more easily which would make the court verdict unreliable.


Or does your silly conspiracy theory assume the corruption conveniently avoids the justice department AND judicial system?


And what exactly is the motive for this attack by the government? You do realize that Obama and the rest of the asshat administration wants to pretend that the war on terror is over right? Every time there is a terrorist attack they try to say it was something else until they're forced by mountains of evidence to admit that YES this is another terrorist attack by more islamic nutbags.


Your whole premise was profoundly ignorant and made no sense what so ever.


If you'd like to take a stab at redeeming yourself, I'll suffer through your posts to see if possibly you have a point in there somewhere. That's my gift to you. I won't do it because I want to but because I feel honor bound to see if you're really as dumb as it seems.
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Old 04-24-2013, 07:15 PM   #10
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Quote:
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This whole Boston bombing thing stinks of a government cover up. i have very heavy doubts that these 2 kids did it.
I see you're still an idiot.
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you're right
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